Not only do I have to see amateur dj's just redline / pin pioneer djm-800's (which are mediocre in the sound quality section anyway), they are now arguing with me about how "it's a pioneer and you are supposed to do that..."

Give me a freekin break, I have been a sound engineer for 13 years in a production house setting and have worked with platinum selling artists... Please, spare me the 'I know all..."

What does everyone else really think about this? Tony freekin Andrews of funktion one thinks DJ's are a joke because.....

They play mp3's.

They play mp3's ripped from youtube that might be in the 128kbps bitrate range.

They redline crap mixers like the pioneer 800 or 1000 or whatever their newest big flagship trash mixer is.

It is probably just a rant by me, but it seems to be a big issue. Not only amateur dj's but I've seen some pro's do it too....

RED MEANS STOP!!!

simple as that, Green means go. its pretty much the simplist thing to understand but ive had many nights ruined by DJs unable to handle this concept. If you cant stop the mixer from clipping and redlining, you are not a DJ.

I just don't remember through my experience when you are supposed to redline a mixer. I must have missed that workshop

AND it is sad to hear a dj redline a mixer, and play fuckin MP3's at the same time? Where did the quality go. Why are these dj's even concerned with what kind of sound they are playing on when it sounds like shit to begin with?

I asked the engineer in Sankeys to turn up the system in the bar because it was too quiet - he just came over and turned the master and gains right up until it was permanently touching the top of the reds. Sounded like arse, but it wasn't even loud enough when there was no one in - let alone full - when I asked him.

Though it's probably the fault of the dj most of the time, that's not to say there aren't exceptions. I expected better from such a well-known club, especially since the amps are in the booth, therefore hardly a faff to alter the gain.

Red is always a warning!

I had the exact same experience at Sankeys a couple of weeks ago, what a joke........lol

recently was given the job of telling the djs when they are clipping the master at a club, not massive djs but definitely big enough to know better. What baffled me was that they were perfectly polite and apologetic when reminded., but why do I have to remind you? You have eyes don't you, and ears. I can hear it clipping and I haven't got the 100watt monitor pointed directly at your ear canal 10"s away. Also this was on a system with quite a lot of limiting going on. From -12db to 0 on the mixer there is no change in volume only the distortion gets louder. Beyond me.... that job lasted one night.

Was it the long-haired "engineer"? He even had the temerity to tell me off in advance in case I shut the cupboard door to the amps (which I was forbidden to touch), as he presumed I wouldn't realise a few kWs of power creates heat. Real twat, that man; presume he's responsible for ruining the Phazon system - despite room changes to fit more people in compared with the old venue - by deftly eq'ing the system to sound muddy and lacking clarity up-top.
Was so embarrassing too - one of the lads from Colour came to chat as he'd not met me and I was playing techno later on... then his eyes met the level-meters. Probably thought I was a right moron even though I'm an absolute obessive for sound-quality.

Well Pioneer has like 8 red lights on the channel and most the clubs I have played the sound guys have the system tuned for the highest red on the channel. When ever I come on it's like the sound drops 20DB cause I don't push it to the red. Then sound guy yells at me for turning the master channel up to compensate for volume drop.

"We keep master knob at 12'oclock no matter what"-Sound guy

so dumb

oh yea and don't say amateurs only red line. I have watched many a "pro" pull this shit

I was playing a pretty famous club lately (i won't name it) but when asked about the rules of the volume limits (expecting to be told just keep it green and it's ok to sometimes hit the orange for a second or so) i was shocked when i was told just keep it at one red on a DJM900 Nexus..

this redline is driving me mad, it doesn't matter whose djing with the exception of some notable exceptions everyone of them does it and the amps are all flashing red thermal and cliplights - what amazes me is the amps seem to put up with and touch wood don't pop.

I'm thinking of putting a mixer inbetween the dj mixer and the amps, not practical but at least I can control the signal - what a pain in the arse they are!

Some not only red line, but turn the EQs all the way to the right

well I read all your comments and conclusion is one. Its a lack of knowledge and education.
Engineer in a club THE CHEAPEST not the best and sound system just as good as engineer. 99% of night clubs is set to make money not to sound good.
Same DJs. Night Club is willing to get any DJ as long as is cheap. Good DJs don't go over red line (maybe few of them)
most of "dummy" djs think that you they play loud they play good.

I'm a sound engineer at 4 major nightclubs in San Francisco. You'd be amazed how many well known DJs I've worked with who run the mixer into the red after repeatedly being told not to. It's not that these guys don't know any better (their productions sound great and they know that clipping is a no-no with digital audio) but half the time they're conditioned to do this because a lot of the clubs they play at don't have the signal chain gain staged properly. They're either told by the engineer to keep it in the red cuz he doesn't know what the fuck he's doing or they don't want to sound quieter than the opener (the openers almost always redline). The other half of the time they're just drunk

The Xone mixers can take quite a beating, but the pioneers instantly start to sound like crap when pushed to two red LEDs especially when you're playing MP3s (don't get me started on that). However there is a master attenuation switch (on the back of the 800 and in the club setup menu of the 900) that reduces the master output by -3, -6, or -12 dB to compensate for redlining. I leave it at -3 and tell them to stay out of the red any way, that way when they inevitbly start to redline I've got some more headroom and 1 red bar is actually ok.

Another thing I do that none of my colleagues really do is tell the dj to keep it right below the red for the entire night, from the opener to the headliner to the closer. I then turn up input gain on the digital processor being fed by the dj mixer that feeds the amps to keep the level appropriate for how many people are in the club. I tell them to keep it at one level so the don't have to guess how loud it should be on the dance floor because they're not on the dance floor, that's my job and it also prevents me from getting yelled at by the club manager for it being too loud (though they rarely tell you its too quiet lol). A lot of my colleagues can't be bothered with this and just leave the master level up to the dj but this way I can be a control freak and make sure your ears don't bleed on the dance floor

peace and beats
Max

please can you be the tech guy at every club in the world

I wish there were more sound engineers like you.

Just one question - how do you solve DJs playing with both vinyl and wav(cd/traktor/usb) back and forth?
Perceived volume and vu-peak can be very different for these two formats...

hate to say krystal klear was well guilty of this last night in leeds. dunno whether it was the sound tech guys fault for having the master control too low but the whole mixer was totally in the red and the sound was awful. bicep sorted it out after and the sound was amazing

@AGFunkyTech - thanks man, as someone said earlier the tech in the club is usually the cheapest not the best. I lucked out getting into this cuz the first club that hired me was top-tier and paid top dollar so I could go demand that other places. most clubs pay peanuts, it can be very frustrating especially when a club dumps a bunch of money into artists, sound system, promotion, then wants to pay the guy who will be running the show all night the same as a starbucks barista :\

as for the differences in mediums I just do some basic level matching, maybe a little high or low shelf eq'ing but thats really it. I'll do my best to make it consistent but as Tony Andrews of Funktion One has repeatedly said the weakest link in the chain is usually the DJ and its not my job to scold them for using mp3s or serato or whatever. I'm way too chill to do that anyway...

a long time ago I asked Justin Martin why he didn't use a laptop and his answer was 'sound quality.' back then I didn't get that the converters in the cdjs are miles better than those found in the traktor and serato boxes (even the new ones) but after working on huge soundsystems for a couple years now I get it.